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Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari
End of Life
40152
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Posted - 2015.09.16 23:46:22 -
[1] - Quote
Aaron,
If the problem is the people can't afford the price of PLEX and you want CCP to reduce the PLEX price to be closer to monthly subscription price why not just suggest players subscribe instead of use PLEX?
From recent figures supplied by CCP Quant, we know that almost 2/3 of the player base have just 1 account.
So I assume you aren't talking about alt account here and believe many people pay their main account with PLEX.
If its finances that are a problem, then I can understand why. It makes no sense to use PLEX paid for with cash, to stay active on a main account. People should subscribe and they'll instantly have the lower price you are petitioning for.
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Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari
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Posted - 2015.09.17 00:16:45 -
[2] - Quote
Aaron wrote:45thtiger 0109 wrote:Aaron wrote:Dear CCP,
I'd like for you to acknowledge that the RL cost of PLEX is having a negative effect on the player numbers. Lots of people are leaving and are finding it difficult to play the game because of limited time and RL finance.
The goal of this petition is to request the revision of the RL cost of PLEX so that it is closer to the monthly sub cost. A lower RL PLEX cost may prompt the PLEX for isk sellers to lower their prices which will help PLEX users stay in the game. If the PLEX sellers have no customers we could see the plex sellers also leave the game.
Please accept these signatures that will show the depth of support on this matter.
Yours Faithfully,
N.B. This is a serious thread which is intended to show the opinions of the players on this very important matter.
_____________________________________________________________________________
Please sign this thread, I believe it is crucial to keeping Eve alive.
Please try to keep this thread free of trolling because it is important, let us ensure that this thread stays open. Sorry Dude this is not going to happen and CCP will not do anything about it and no I will not sign a petition regarding this matter. IBTL Cool, if this is your attitude then you must accept failing numbers without crying about it. Open your eyes brother, can't you see the plex users crying on the forum? A petition thread is simply signed or not signed. Not signing means you disapprove and that you don't need to comment. Keep your short sighted opinions to yourself !
But if it is really the in game PLEX users that you are concerned for, then that has nothing to do with the RL cost of PLEX.
To subscribe an account for a hobby is normal discretionary spending we take into account when working out our finances. To purchase PLEX on top of that to sell for ISK in game is not something CCP needs to subsidise.
People who can afford that don't need to worry about a couple of dollars in savings.
So what you really are concerned about is the in game price of PLEX and believe that the shortage of supply is because of RL economic reasons. That doesn't make much sense.
If you want to reduce the in game price that's one thing. But suggesting that the out of game price should be lowered to make discretionary spending easier is just asking for straight charity from CCP for the players that can already afford it anyway.
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Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari
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40157
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Posted - 2015.09.17 00:38:10 -
[3] - Quote
Scotchmo wrote:IS there enough that can afford it already that CCP is ok with them being the only group that buys plex?
I would think they want to constantly grow instead of milk a selection of their population till the end.
Who's being milked when they buy PLEX for cash and how is dropping the price by a couple of dollars suddenly going to open up a new market of players?
The same people who an afford it now will be able to afford it then and people who now can't afford to purchase PLEX with cash aren't going to be able to afford it just because it's $2-3 cheaper. That's not much of a saving if discretionary spending is that tight for someone.
It seems Aaron's real concern is that in game demand for PLEX is higher than current market supply which is causing inflation.
He wants to see in game supply increased to match or exceed demand and drive prices in game down again so that those who PLEX their account are able to do so for less in game effort expended.
If it's more supply that is needed, it would seem lowering the price of a single PLEX wouldn't be that significant. Better to give a bigger discount for purchasing the multiple PLEX packs so that when someone purchases PLEX the discount encourages them to purchase more than they otherwise would. That will create more supply to market as people sell the extra PLEX they buy compulsively because it looks like a good deal.
But lowering the price of PLEX by a couple of dollars won't necessarily create increased buying.
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Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari
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Posted - 2015.09.17 00:48:39 -
[4] - Quote
Aaron wrote:Scipio Artelius wrote:People who can afford that don't need to worry about a couple of dollars in savings.
Again, what about the people who can't afford a couple dollars in savings? What's the answer? Is is **** you, you're poor? The in game price of a PLEX is affected by the RL cost of it. If plex were -ú9.99 then perhaps the in game cost of a plex could be 700m, all parties benefit in this example.
No, my answer them is the same as the question I asked in my first reply in this thread.
If you are worried about people not being able to afford PLEX, why not recommend those people subscribe?
That will be even cheaper for them than this petition.
However, if someone is subscribed and they want to buy PLEX for cash on top of that to sell for ISK in game so that someone else can play based on PLEXing their account (that seems to be what you are concerned for), then the group that purchase PLEX for cash clearly have the discretionary budget to do so. A couple of dollars in savings isn't going to suddenly change the number of people that can afford extra again on top.
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Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari
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Posted - 2015.09.17 00:58:25 -
[5] - Quote
Ultim8Evil wrote:"People" aren't leaving, accounts are.
The ISBoxer ban and the price of PLEX is forcing people to reduce the number of accounts they use.
In the "good old days" of 60k PCU, how many of them were 20 account multiboxing miners?
Hundreds. Thousands.
Nearly 2/3 of players (64% +/-) have just 1 account.
86% of players have 2 or fewer accounts.
It's been consistent like that for the last decade.
The use of multiple accounts isn't as widespread in the player base as we often assume. It's only a relatively small percentage of us in the player base that have multiple accounts. We are probably the same people that post regularly in the forum, attend Fanfest, post on Reddit, etc. and are otherwise heavily invested in the game.
So it probably seems to us that everyone has multiple accounts, because the group of people that we all converse with regularly have multiple accounts. But there's a larger group of people who just play the game with one account.
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Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari
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Posted - 2015.09.17 01:09:46 -
[6] - Quote
Ultim8Evil wrote:So when the (random percentage ahead) 1% who had 10-20+ accounts each start cutting back, which has the biggest effect on the PCU?
Hint: It's not the 64% with one account. Someone with one account will either pay the subscription with RL cash, or grind that little bit harder to make 1.2 bill in 30 days.
It's the 10-20+ account players who need to find half a Titan of ISK per month to keep their personal armada going.
30% drop in players online this year alone can't be accounted for with the reduction in accounts of just a few players.
If you really believe people haven't left the game and it's only consolidation of accounts by <1% of players, then I'd like to see calculations in detail for that.
e. I don't personally see the drop in players online as important. I think it's a lot to do with longer skills queues, sov issues, etc. but those people are all still subscribed and playing skill queue online. I'm just stirring with the above since it's a common line of argument by people.
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Scipio Artelius
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Posted - 2015.09.17 01:59:31 -
[7] - Quote
Scotchmo wrote:Do you think PVP activity (and dangerous PVE) would increase or decrease with lower plex prices?
I do not know enough to say one way or the other.
In game or out of game?
Aaron's proposal is to drop the RL price of PLEX by a couple of dollars so that supply to the market can be increased and people can PLEX their account and play easier.
Since people trying to PLEX their account, need ISK to afford the PLEX, the amount of anything dangerous isn't likely to increase, since any loss affects their ability to meet the ISK need.
I don't think Aaron's proposal will make any difference at all to the amount of PLEX purchased, or who purchases it. I don't believe that will increase supply on the market and won't create any deflationary pressure. It certainly won't increase the levels of risk people take.
Players habits don't seem to have changed in terms of pvp or pve as a result of the increase in PLEX price, so why would it change if the price went down again?
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Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari
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Posted - 2015.09.17 02:24:45 -
[8] - Quote
Aaron wrote:Paranoid Loyd wrote:Aaron wrote:My opinions promote customer satisfaction and loyalty. No not really, to me they show you don't understand basic economics and have selfishly requested that the company run itself into the ground. Unfortunately they seem to be doing that just fine without your ideas. Decreasing numbers is not "just fine" imo.
What we don't know though Aaron is what those decreasing numbers are, other than decreasing numbers of people logging in.
A large number of people could still be subbed, but not login as often currently, for a whole host of reasons.
There was someone a while back that made the observation that if things were so grim, don't you think CCP would be doing something drastic to address it?
People want security in their job no matter who they are. CCP just the same and I am sure the executive management and investors want security for the company too.
So if things are so bad, they would be doing things with a short term view, in address it immediately.
Yet still CCPs vision appears to be much longer term and they are progressing on the development plan at the pace outlined by CCP Seagull at Fanfest 2014, when we know at that time there were 480,000 odd active accounts (from the number of names on the monument).
In addition, as much as I dislike a lot of what Ripard says, he makes a good point in a current Reddit thread about a mass dump of PLEX onto the market:
http://puu.sh/kdZDL/b4b0a0836d.png
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Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari
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Posted - 2015.09.17 02:53:00 -
[9] - Quote
Avvy wrote:F2P players don't contribute much to the game, some don't even buy from the in-game shop (EVE's shop isn't good enough for that purpose as it is). All they really do is bolster the numbers, which can be good for a game that's heavily in decline. EVE's not got to that stage.
This is not quite true.
Players that PLEX their account create a demand for PLEX, which is balanced against supply. More demand is good, because it drives inflation (as we are currently seeing) and encourages people to pay cash for PLEX to sell to those PLEXing their account.
They still contribute just as much to the game as people that pay cash for their subscription and in some ways it can be argued that they contribute more to the financial stability of CCP, since PLEX costs more than a subscription.
For every player using F2P by PLEXing their account, CCP still get paid.
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Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari
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Posted - 2015.09.17 03:03:30 -
[10] - Quote
Avvy wrote:But the F2P crowd (doesn't necessarily mean someone that PLEXes their account) tend to be the same, so trying to attract that crowd isn't something a game should do, unless they're set up for it or the game's active player count is getting dangerously low.
Ah yeah, totally agree. Keep Eve, Eve.
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